maxamet steel toughness
- December 2, 2020
Re: CPM REX 45 | Edge Performance. These steels were dubbed “Super Hard”  or “Ultra Hard”  High Speed Steels, though eventually they were generally lumped into the “Super High Speed Steel” category along with M4 and T15. How can a knife consumer determine that by looking at the steel composition? ZDP-189 gets a toughness rating of “3,” the same as S30V and VG-10 despite the very high hardness and carbide volume of ZDP-189. Next the descriptions of steels are taken directly from Buck Knives and Cold Steel. Also it’s not clear how this is different than “holding an edge.” And what does he mean by “remained usable”?  Nehrenberg, Alvin E., Thoni V. Philip, and Steven Gary. Click here to download a PDF of this steel chart (107kb) Click here to download a two-page brochure with more details about steel(14 MB). He says that vanadium helps produce a fine grain structure which is true enough in small doses. You can read more about the development of these steels in this article. Erroneous “OPINIONS “ on a knife steel they have The following are tool steels, which are alloy steels commonly used to produce hardened cutting tools: . I’ve looked for information about this and can’t find anything. 440A and 7Cr17, despite being the same thing, get very different ratings, particularly in corrosion resistance where 440A is given a “7” and 7Cr17 is given a “3”. The full-flat-ground blade includes a fully accessible Trademark Round Hole™ for swift, ambidextrous, one-handed opening. I had to read that second sentence a couple times before I figured out what he was saying but I have to disagree. Could you give a recommendation on which steel you think would be best, between M2, M35, M42, T15? It really isn’t, as Maxamet is a high speed steel designed to be a carbide replacement for better toughness but retaining much of the hot hardness, and is not stainless. I would rate the toughness of VG-10 higher than 440C despite Dan’s ratings, and would probably score M390 a notch below where Dan has it based on its high carbide volume  and my own testing . I’m not sure where the hardness ratings came from as most of these steels can be heat treated to a wide range of hardness values. Hover over an element to learn more about how it affects steel performance characteristics. This expression of the Para 3 combines all the defining qualities of this best-in-class folding knife design with the extreme edge retention and toughness of Maxamet blade steel. I have written several articles now on the history of tool steels and high speed steels. However, they provide specialized use cases for those that prefer maximum edge retention at the detriment of other properties. But actually, it is not. The high tungsten high speed steel, later named T1, was the standard for cutting tools for several decades. Everything is exactly as youâ€™d expect from this model, with the addition of a maxamet blade, which has surprised me in its toughness and edge retention These steels offer relatively low toughness when compared with many other knife steels, but offer excellent edge retention. Therefore I will not analyze these ratings as I already did so. So I did a couple google searches, opened all of the articles in the first 2 or 3 pages, and kept each that had ratings for blade steels. 6 (1988): 477-479. Rex 121 Steel (1925°F austenitize) – 32% carbide volume, Maxamet Steel (1975°F austenitize) – 22% carbide volume. Required fields are marked *. Cutting performance, toughness and edge retention are off the charts. This meant that tools could be run at higher speeds where they heat up to higher temperatures because good hardness is still maintained.  Makovec, Heinz, Ingrid Schemmel, and Ernst Putzgruber. I would say if it’s not broken it remains usable.  Wert, David E., Gregory J. Del Corso, and Harrison A. Garner Jr. “High-hardness powder metallurgy tool steel and article made therefrom.” U.S. Patent 6,482,354, issued November 19, 2002. What it is: CPM 154 is the "Crucible Particle Metallurgy" version of 154 CM stainless steel, and is widely regarded as a "super steel" for its properties and performance. 43. FK Member Posts: 427 Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2004 4:33 pm Location: CT USA. After all, they are designed to be heat treated to at least 67 Rc. Larrin, Triple or even quadruple tempering was also found to be important for minimizing retained austenite in these high carbon grades. Therefore, super hard high speed steels could be developed with powder metallurgy technology which also utilized increased vanadium content for a combination of both high hardness and high wear resistance. I am relatively frequently relieved that I remembered to not bring a knife with me every time I visit an airport or a theme park with metal detectors. Thanks! Metallurgy and Testing of Knives and Steel. I will be criticizing their descriptions of steels and steel properties as well as the ratings that they provide. “Ultra hard high speed steel.” U.S. Patent 3,259,489, issued July 5, 1966. European PM Conference Proceedings, vol. The super hard high speed steels (>68 Rc or so) are interesting from the standpoint of knife enthusiasts and knifemakers, particularly since knives are so often produced in the 58-61 Rc range. He has some very pretty charts summarizing the ratings of all of the steels, which I have reproduced below: If you compare the ratings above with those from the Knife Informer ratings you will notice that they are nearly identical. Plagiarized all the way down to misspelling lath.  Gill, James P. “Alloy steel tool.” U.S. Patent No. Steel Chart. However, Rex 121 is at an even higher level of insanity in terms of wear resistance and would be expected to be another notch higher. “Elmax – A third generation Austrian, powder-metal stainless steel that is noted for its fine carbide distribution with extremely low inclusion content.”, “O-1 is an ideal steel for edged weapons and tools because it is known for its ability to be differentially heat treated.”. In an alloy, Tungsten contributes to the harden-ability, and with this much Tungsten it’s no surprise that Spyderco hardened Maxamet up to 67-68 RC. Larrin, Since these are all powder metallurgy steels with high alloy content they are all relatively expensive. The full-flat-ground blade includes a fully accessible Trademark Round Hole™ for swift, ambidextrous, one-handed opening. Looking forward to reading the updated version. I like some of the writing better in this article than the previous two. It checks out at 64rc, and is does very well. However, that's still lower than Crucible CPM REX 121 steel and many other alloys with comparable performance. according to this study : https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/isijinternational/46/5/46_5_782/_pdf/-char/en https://www.patreon.com/Knifesteelnerds, Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window). here is an article where I took micrographs of 42 knife steels, https://www.bladehq.com/cat–Best-Knife-Steel-Guide–3368. For example, he says as anyone does in these kinds of articles that higher carbon means higher hardness. In terms of filing dates, this included M44 steel of Braeburn Alloy Steel (1960) , M41 steel of Crucible Steel (1961) , M42 steel of Vasco Metals (1963) , and M43 steel (1965) . While 10% Tungsten(W) may seem a lot, but in reality it isn't, because Tungsten atoms are so heavy, in other words, very heavy elements like Tungsten, produce fewer atoms to form carbides. Different elements diffuse at different rates, (typically the larger the atom, the slower it diffuses). there is at least 2 grades didn’t have tungsten at all , why there is no even just one grade without vanadium ? “420HC is a somewhat less expensive American-made stainless alternative to 440C. Maxamet Para 3 continues day 35 update, you asked for it now what would you like to see? To further distinguish it, its textured G10 scales are a distinctive dark gray color.  http://www.phase-trans.msm.cam.ac.uk/2004/Tempered.Martensite/tempered.martensite.html. At least he says that he took them from those sources rather than claiming them as his own. Those carbide contents are supported by micrographs I took of both of those steels, where you can see that Rex 121 has both more carbide and larger carbides than Maxamet. I’m not trying to sell knives or create clickbait. 420HC is not necessarily made in America and is not similar in composition to 440C, as 440C has much higher carbon and chromium. 3, p. 1. I wrote about this development in this article. silicon addition give the highest hardness compared to cobalt , aluminium & nickel . Another interesting and informative article, thanks for the good read. He at least mentions the effect of edge geometry. T15 appeared by 1946 as Vasco Supreme , and M15 appeared by 1951 as Vasco Supreme A . The only edge retention value I have for any of these steels is from Maxamet. Prioritize toughness for rigid prints. Nothing about 420HC makes it less tough or corrosion resistant than 440C. With the introduction of powder metallurgy it was possible to increase the vanadium content to offer a combination of very high wear resistance and hardness. In terms of toughness the carbide replacement high speed steels are relatively low. They achieved the high hardness by combining high carbon content with high cobalt additions. These steels were dubbed “super high speed steels” due to their high wear resistance. Therefore, the super hard high speed steels can offer performance closer to cemented carbide in combination with higher toughness to reduce the possibility of tool chipping or breakage. Lower hardness and lower wear resistance than all of them. you are doing an excellent job on educating and encouraging critical thinking and reviewing for us knife fans, steel nerds and science nuts. Can you tell me what the rationale is for relating sharpness (their word) to secondary hardening? Steel Chart. 66% Score of Average of Top 5: 251; closest steel is CTS-XHP at 242 So I don’t know if the number is supposed to be based on maximum achievable hardness or typical hardness in production knives. He defines edge retention in terms of wear resistance and hardness so that is the basis upon which I will analyze his rankings. Cet acier, en revan I’ll do that when I update the article. The full-flat-ground blade includes a fully accessible Trademark Round Hole™ for swift, ambidextrous, one-handed opening. Both elements are used to increase hardness and toughness. They have the appearance of providing useful information but really doesn’t tell a consumer very much. Here is a link to a good paper on Silicon in High Speed steels: https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Fu-Sheng_Pan/publication/226290568_Carbides_in_high-speed_steels_containing_silicon/links/00b7d520356e23d9e5000000.pdf. He says that manganese “[i]ncreases toughness and hardenability in non-stainless steels and helps to produce a fine, dense, grain structure in stainless steels by reducing the size of the Carbides.” It does not improve toughness or reduce the size of the carbides, and he doubles down on this later in the article by saying “A blades toughness is generally determined by the steel’s Manganese content,” which it certainly is not. AUS-8 gets a toughness rating of “4” where 8Cr13MoV gets a “3” despite the two being similar steels. You can get secondary hardening without V or even without Mo/W but the most dramatic secondary hardening is seen with Mo/W. This Para 3 features all the characteristics of the best-selling standard model, plus the supercharged edge holding and toughness of a Maxamet blade.  https://knifesteelnerds.com/2018/06/04/toughness-testing-cru-wear-z-wear/, A Great de-bunking article on steel articles, Maxamet’s distinguishing metallurgical characteristic is the high carbon content (2.15%) and the inclusion of 10% Tungsten. Toughness testing by Knife Steel Nerds used steel heat treated by Warren Krywko and myself, and machined by Alpha Knife Supply and Mike Pierce. This blade steel exhibits good toughness, but it does not meet the level of M390. 534, pp. I wrote about what cemented carbide is in this article about Sandrin knives. With steel element explanations and steel type descriptions that are straight up wrong, plagiarism from Cold Steel (that was assigned to the wrong steel), and plagiarized ratings I can’t recommend this article at all. You can see what I am talking about by looking at the toughness of Rex 76 and Rex 121 compared with other Crucible steels [26-33], or HAP 72 compared with other Hitachi steels . For example, M35 is M2 with a cobalt addition, and M33 and M34 are essentially M1 with a cobalt addition. Bohler Uddeholm M390 Bohler M390 is widely revered as being the best all-around knife steel, which has led top companies to widely utilize it in higher end knives. The Chromium likely is the element that drives the ZDP into being a stainless steel.  Hellman, P., and H. Wisell. I don’t like reducing things down to a single numerical rating when some properties are more complex. This steel is particularly well suited to applications where strength and impact resistance are valued above all other considerations and will produce blades of nearly legendary toughness.”. This steel was eventually called ASP2060 by Erasteel and Vanadis 60 by Uddeholm. However, knifemakers and knife companies also wanted a more balanced stainless steel as the high wear resistance of S90V can make processing of the steel and sharpening for the end customer more difficult. 2002. The metallurgy of these types of steels is also interesting. It is a bit difficult to summarize within this article which already requires many words to evaluate the different rankings. They are especially critical in survival situations. Купити Ніж Spyderco Manix 2 Maxamet Steel (C101PGY2) 871320 в інтернет-магазині ІБІС - найкраща ціна в Україні - 6530 грн. Even where I criticize the articles that does not necessarily mean that I think the author is clueless, or that none of the articles are worth reading, or that they don’t regularly call their mothers like good boys should. To further distinguish it, its textured G-10 scales are a distinctive dark gray color. At these elevated temperatures, alloying elements are able to move around in the steel, or diffuse. Grinding and finishing is also difficult, even in the annealed condition because of the high vanadium content. Specifications. “Effects of structure on toughness and grindability of high-speed steel.” In presentation at International Colloquium on ‘High-speed steels’, pp. I assist on multiple “beginner bladesmithing” groups, and these charts are constantly floating around. 27:51 . who can possibly know which to pick? Great article Larrin! I have a Dragonfly in ZDP-189. He begins the article by saying, “In choosing the best pocket knife you should pay particular attention to the type of steel used in the blade. This Para Military 2 features all the characteristics of the best-selling standard model, plus the supercharged edge holding and toughness of a Maxamet blade. 1.4034 stainless steel is essentially a 420HC made in Germany but is given the highest score for toughness of “7” a full 2 points higher than 420HC, and higher than the high toughness steels 5160 and 1050. Nickel (Ni) DescriptionThe Spyderco ParaMilitary 2 Compression Lock folder has become one of the world's most popular pocket knives. This article was written by Matt Davidson of Knife Informer. However, there are still easy things to point out in most of these, first here are the ratings themselves: 1050 gets a “1” for corrosion resistance while 1075 and 1060 get a “0” which he says is “because of the lower carbon content,” which wouldn’t make any difference in a steel with no chromium. They are kind of their own thing though so I left them out of this article. Powder metallurgy technology further increased possibilities for Super Hard High Speed Steels. 11 Jan. 1938. Amer. Maxamet steel specs give a hardness range from 64rc to 71rc. Thank you for pointing out the mistakes and inconsistencies , big and small, on the steel reviews. Institute of Mechanical Engineers 100 (1932): 257-263. “Toughness – How much energy the blade can absorb before fracturing. These cemented carbide grades combine very high wear resistance, strength, and stiffness for good performance in high speed machining operations. The Vasco researchers found 8% Co and the particular Mo-W content they used to offer the best balance of high hardness and good toughness. It did very well in the test as we would expect for a steel with both high hardness and high vanadium content. Frank. There is so much misinformation online and on the forums. For example, both T15 and M4 were found to have a large improvement in toughness and grindability due to the great reduction in carbide size from powder metallurgy. 6 recipes are given in all (4 low, 2 high) with a range of final hardnesses, soit’s not just a matter of assuming high hardness = high sharpness. And 3V gets a lower result in CATRA testing than Elmax, S30V, or S35VN which are given a lower “4” rating . This expression of the Para 3 combines all the defining qualities of this best-in-class folding knife design with the extreme edge retention and toughness of Maxamet blade steel. Maxamet blade version of the Native 5 with gray FRN handle. Top. ASP2060/Vanadis 60, HAP 72, Rex 86, and S290 would also be expected to be a similar range for edge retention as those steels also have 5-6.5% vanadium. the toughness of silicon alloyed steel is also higher than the cobalt alloyed steel although higher hardness !! And improvements in composition control allowed more tight targets to appropriately balance the chemistry for maximum hardness . However, he also says that, “Many people report that they are able to get knives using steels that contain vanadium such as CPM S30V sharper than they can non-Vanadium steels such as ATS-34.” I’m not sure I’ve heard anyone report that before, as the hard vanadium carbides typically make sharpening more difficult. Maxamet is hard and tough enough to meet the demands of rolling and shaping hot steel. M390 gets a higher score than Elmax for toughness even though Elmax is tougher. Even with a fine microstructure from powder metallurgy, toughness is inherently low in the 68-72 Rc range. Compare T1 and T4 in the image below, for example, where T4 is identical to T1 but with 5% cobalt. That seems like enough examples of poor ratings of steel. Maxamet is a complex steel alloy that offers unprecedented toughness and edge retention. electroslag, forged ring/ block,etc. ... On the business end, a variety of premium stainless steel blades provide low-friction edge geometry, extreme toughness, and exceptional edge retention. Looking at the datasheet one element stands out–Tungsten. After hardening those operations are even more challenging as would be expected from the high hardness. I’ve learned quite a bit from you. Maybe blade geometry? “High speed steel.” U.S. Patent 3,113,862, issued December 10, 1963. Crucible Steel initially argued that higher than 3% was unnecessary and not found to be beneficial ; however, the continued existence of ASP60 and the development of higher vanadium high speed steels by Crucible since seem to contradict their initial arguments. The steel was introduced to the knife world by one of KAI’s Uber Triples, the ZT 0888. To understand how I know the approximate properties of different knife steels, you have to read my articles on what controls different knife properties. I don’t want to have ratings with no accompanying explanation for how the scores were determined. The smaller the crystals are, the tougher and stronger the steel with be, and the better it will hold an edge. The Native 5 features a patterned FRN handle with two separate finger choils. Alloy is high on Cobalt and Vanadium. Thank you for really summing up the fact that ranking multiple steels is not as simple as “what’s the best?”. Powder metallurgy steel was first produced on a commercial scale by Crucible Steel at the end of 1970. ... Carpenter produces this powder steel. Maybe. But the # 9 of company A was different thickness than #9 of company B !! “New Bohler powder metallurgy high speed steel with excellent hot hardness.” In Proc. Here is an article about how chipping of edges happens to understand the mechanisms that occur and so how we evaluate different steels based on those mechanisms. In the old days you ordered steel sheet and wire by a number. Tool steel grades used in cutlery : A, D, O, M, T, S, L, W. See also AISI Tool Steel Grades. I thought this statement looked familiar and indeed it does because I found the same thing written about 1055 in the Cold Steel-written portion of the KnifeCenter article above. No, toughness has nothing to do with a blade easily warping.  Harvey, Richard F., and Charles W. Schuck. Many of the descriptions of the steel types are questionable as well, such as, “D2 – An American made, but less expensive version of CPM S30V.”. This shows how good Maxamet is at this one particular thing. The toughness is tested by averaging three specimens which are unnotched subsize charpy specimens. Also, a person new to steel terms doesn’t know what having “fine grains” means in a knife. He also says what the different elements do to a steel (oh no….) Here are the ratings: The most questionable ratings in this chart are perhaps corrosion resistance. Where would Rex 45 fit into these steels?? The answer is that S110V doesn’t get harder than 1075 because it has to do with how much carbon is in solution during the high temperature hardening/austenitizing treatment and must be balanced with all of the other elements in the steel. The legacy of some of these grades goes back even further, however. The predicted value for Maxamet is close to the experimental value above, however, which gives me some hope for the validity of the predictions. It does have grains, yes, but it does not have a sandy or grainy appearance.  Emmons, Joseph V. “Steel alloy and articles made therefrom.” U.S. Patent 1,937,334, issued November 28, 1933. Someone who has been around knives a little while and learned a thing or two can see that S90V has higher wear resistance than 420. This steel combined 3% vanadium along with high carbon and cobalt to achieve these properties. and it does not go particularly well. I prefer to learn and educate. Typically low hardenability steels are best for differential heat treatments because the edge can be quenched so it is hard while the spine is left to air cool to be soft. The high toughness steels 5160, 15N20, L6, and 8670 barely have any carbide at all: 5160 (1525°F) That, in combination with the relatively low vanadium content, is probably why M42 has relatively good toughness. It also incorporates an index-finger choil that allows a forward grip for enhanced control. Never used, let alone tested, put in print, so someone Too much toughness can lead to a blade easily warped.”. There was a rumor about a new Maxamet PM2 release this year. Crucible researchers used … C. R. : The new Generation of High speed steels – Their metallurgical characteristics Metals Engineering Quarterly American Society for Metals, February 1966. The discovery of high speed steel in the late 1890’s ushered in the modern era of tool steel. “People want to try new, harder-working steels on their existing favorite knives. 66% Score (below this but above 33% is a steel that scores a 1): 372 (66% of Maxamet's 563); CPM 10V at 389. The steel was found to have a good combination of toughness, corrosion resistance, and very high wear resistance. Perhaps it would be good to mention what type of cutting he means when he says that the blade may not “stay sharp.”, “Wear Resistance – How long the blade remains usable and resists chipping and other abrasions.”. Your email address will not be published. I’m not a fan of how he lists the steels in groups from “ultra premium” down to “low end” which is only in terms of edge retention. In defining wear resistance he says that “the amount, type and, distribution of carbides within the steel are what determines its wear resistance,” which I point out because it is a true statement that I found.
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